Moose Goes Forth

[Científico]

Focus on your job search first and foremost. That comes before women obviously.

I went through something similar in 2019 and funny enough, I had some great cold approach experiences when the #1 thing I was focusing on was just getting a job (since I was travelling all over the place for interviews).

 

[Beam]

Focus on your job search first and foremost. That comes before women obviously.

I went through something similar in 2019 and funny enough, I had some great cold approach experiences when the #1 thing I was focusing on was just getting a job (since I was travelling all over the place for interviews).

I agree, that will my focus for sure. That's awesome that worked out for you! Now with the rona I'm guessing most interviews will be through zoom.

 

[Beam]

Updates. Last day at my job was Friday. No luck with the job search so far so am now unemployed. While finding a job is still my number one priority I have gotten some approaches in over the last few weeks. Most have been from behind and have involved me running up just ahead of her and turning back (which has surprisingly been quite natural and the girls don't seem taken aback at all, a few times they have even smiled warmly - just further reinforcement that talking to girls is ok and natural - I forget this way too often). Some of these were while I was out for a run in a singlet so I just "pretended" that "I just noticed you while running past".

Couple of sticking points I've noticed:

Voice - Even in my approaches that have gone well to date and have gotten me dates (none from the last few weeks, these ones are from late last year and early this year, pre-COVID), my voice hasn't generally really strong on the openers and those approaches worked because the girl liked me. I notice my voice has been coming from the throat not the diaphragm. And I end my sentences with an upwards inflection. I need to work on downwards inflections and making it more firm and grounded. I notice that this naturally happens when I can tell the girl is attracted to me. When I am unsure if she is or she looks like the type of girl that has generally never given me the time of day, it starts to falter, as if I am expecting she is going to reject me and so I make it even easier by fumbling over my words, turning it into a self fulfilling prophecy.

Beta number asking - The girls have generally been the ones to say "I need to go" or "I'm going to go now". Obviously the interactions are not stimulating enough to keep them there. So interest bait and dropping things in the conversation that turn off her autopilot are something that need to be incorporated. And using more qualifying statements. When she has gone to leave I've been taking quick grabs for a meetup - "hey we should go out for a walk (all the bars are closed where I live - we are still in lockdown) - let me get your number" Clumsy clumsy clumsy. Not even waiting for her to agree to the meet before trying to get details. Not qualifying her at all. Walk is obviously boring so should think of more interesting activities or phrase the walk as an adventure. I've gotten the boyfriend objection a few times, I don't fully believe it and fully believe it's because the interaction hasn't been interesting enough - I am just background noise.

Girls almost expecting me to talk to them
A few times when I've tried directly complementing women on what they are wearing, I've gotten very unenthusiastic "thank you's. Once I was walking in the park and a girl was trying to fold up her picnic rug which was blowing everywhere and struggling. I said loudly "need a hand?" and she responded "no I'm ok thaannk yoou". In another situation the girl actually had her back to me - I spoke loudly, and she didn't even turn around "it's ok, thaannk yoou" snarkily. This one in particular must have noticed me through her peripheral vision. The tone of their voices to me sound like this is a regular occurrence. I feel like they are noticing me, and are categorizing me into the "another guy who has ulterior motives" camp. I'm not standing out enough for them to do a double take and go "wait a minute", this guys actually attractive. I need more fundamental work for sure, haven't been able to get a proper haircut in months due to COVID (I've given myself haircuits but it ain't the same). But have been working out at home like mad. And this hasn't happened when I've done the "I just noticed you" while running shtick, where I have generally been received warmly.

I read this comment from Chase on one of Merchants Kins FRs and think something similar may be happening here:

It seems like a lot of these women know you're going to approach before you do, which means you are signaling too much. It can feel very awkward (very high pressure) to a woman to have a guy looking at her or otherwise obviously planning to come talk to her from far away, then have to wait for this guy to approach, and open. Can sometimes be GREAT if she's way into you or your game's super solid... but otherwise, you want it to seem as casual as possible, kind of "Oh wow, I just noticed you." Women seeming to know you're going to approach like this probably means you're staring too much, and need to get better at using your peripheral vision.

So in summary:

Voice - downwards inflections, use less ums and ahs, speak from the diaphragm regardless of what the girl looks like (and assume attraction even if she looks like a girl who's never given you the time of day before). Be in control.

Interaction itself - seed fun date idea in her mind before she says she has to leave, so the number grab at the end isn't so damn clumsy. Start with this first before focusing on instant dates. Tease and qualify her. She looks attractive to you, but she needs to work to maintain your interest.

Pre-opening - A lot of girls are noticing you, but it's probably because you are signalling too much. Work on refining the "I just noticed you" and feign being taken aback technique.

What I am really excited for is for when masks in public are not mandatory anymore. A lot of these interactions don't feel genuine to me and a little desperate - like "I haven't even seen your face properly but I still want to go out with you". I can make good guesses as to how attractive they are based on body, fashion and the top half of their face, but it still ain't the same.

 

[Beam]

Three approaches today. All of them were really fashionable and wearing almost the same thing (white top/blouse with blue jeans) . I wanted to test out the same opener with all of them to see what sort of response it would get.

1. Gorgeous black girl - Was way ahead of me so I had to jog to catch up, which I did at the traffic light. Delivered the line "didn't you know you're not allowed to look this fashionable walking down a random street in the middle of a work day?". She didn't hear with earphones so I repeated it and she laughed "you are TOO funny" but it was genuine. We got to chatting, exchanged names - I asked her what she was getting up to - she was going home after an hour long break from work. Brain was thinking of how to do the boyfriend screen that I've read about (instead of waiting for the "I have a boyfriend" line, you, in response to somewhere she is going or where she has just been, say "with your boyfriend?" or something similar which she'll then respond to giving you an indication of whether she is single or not) but it didn't make sense in this context since she was on a work break. She then asked me. Stupidly I said that I was going to see my BIL and sister (who actually just lived down the road we were crossing, completely unplanned) which was in the other direction. Lights turned green, we walked, she started chatting about what she was doing after work after I asked. It happened pretty quickly that we parted ways before I seeded the idea of a date and number closed, because I'd already told her I was going the other way. Now I think I'll just say I'm taking a quick scroll but have to get back home giving me plausible deniability to keep walking with her while also adding a time constraint to the interaction. This one should have been a number close.

2. Brunette with billowing white blouse - Walking towards me. Delivered the opener, she laughed but continued on her way. Wouldn't stop despite my persistence.

3. Super sexy redhead - Spotted her at the traffic light. Delivered it after she had noticed me but I think I was staring a bit too much. Damn she was sexy. Delivered the same line and had to repeat it again (earphones). She laughed "hahaha oh my god SHUT UP" in a "oh you!" tone. But lights turned green and she started walking really really fast. I tried persisting while crossing the road but she wasn't listening. I stopped at the end of the road and she went ahead, but then looked over her shoulder and said sheepishly "thank you". Maybe when I stopped she saw that I wasn't going to follow her and then might have thought I wasn't actually hitting on her and was just being nice, hence the apologetic tone. I felt like with how fast she was walking I would have been too aggressive following her, also she was heading down a side street off the main road hence it might have scared her.

Will be keeping this opener in the toolbox, might work well in any other situation where the girl is dressed up way more than everyone else around her. I'm trying to build up a variety of openers, specifically related to her style. It's a weak spot of mine trying to deliver funny, unique ones in the spur of the moment.

I stopped another girl to ask her what the style of clothing she was wearing was because I was genuinely curious. It was a black and white pantsuit. She didn't look that attractive from far away but up close she looked ok, she seemed very suspicious though, I didn't pursue.

 

[Beam]

Ok, think I’m well overdue for a journal update. First of all I got a new job which starts in two weeks. Pretty surprising how quickly I got it, since it’s pretty much exactly what I wanted (at least on paper) and I had expected to knuckle down for a few months before getting a break like this.

When I became unemployed three weeks ago, I made myself a schedule, where I would devote mornings to the job search (7:30-11:00), midday to going out to meet women (11:00-1:00), afternoon to upskilling for jobs (1:00-4:00), exercise (4:00-6:00) and then dinner and upskilling for the rest of the day.

What happened was my game time started spilling over to the 1:00-4:00 session consistently as I browsed the forum for feedback. I thought “you know what, I got time off, it’s warm, I’m going to go all in on this for a bit” and started Chases 4 approach a day challenge (in secret). Today was my 11th day.

Summary of the 11 days so far (I have a detailed spreadsheet where I’ve broken down each interaction but it’s not here):

Day 1:
7 approaches, 1 *number close*. I put that in asterisk because she took my number and of course didn’t text me. I learnt to never let her do that and use Cientificos response of “that’s not how this works. It’s my job to persist, yours to resist” line, or just “I’ll take your number”

Day 2:
7 approaches, 1 number close (cute uni student). Didn’t respond to icebreaker or my reengagement text a week later. This one I just deep dived, she told me a lot but I didn’t generate enough attraction.

Day 3:
7 approaches. Got caught up in trying to find a good observational opener that I didn’t approach a really hot one, when I could have just said “I saw you a you looked fantastic and had to say something”. Later on, ran across the road and used this on a hot tall blonde walking down the street. She laughed, we talked for a long time, she told me how nice it was to speak to someone after lockdown, clumsily went for the instadate. Said “I don’t know what my boyfriend would think about that”. We eventually parted ways and she sincerely thanked me using my name.

Day 4:
5 approaches, 1 instadate, 1 instagram close. This girl was wearing all Nike, which is how I opened her walking down the street, saying that “I see you’re a Nike girl through and through”. She laughed and we chatted more while walking. When I sensed it was starting to die down I came out with “Actually, the Nike uniform was one reason I came to talk to you, but I also thought you were really cute too”. She was surprised and said this had never happened to her before. Got her logistics, she wasn’t doing anything so I suggested we grab coffee. Took ages to find a place – she was opening up to me a lot and talking, but my mind was half listening and half thinking where to go. Thankfully found a place and we chatted more. After I was done I said I had to leave (which I did since I needed to meet friends) and said we should catch up again. She agreed, but has been pretty flakey with the texts. We have a tentative date set for next Wednesday.

Day 5:
5 approaches, one facebook close (she had a partner but wanted to meet for coffee), one number close (the woman who I had a date with yesterday)

Day 6:
6 approaches, two number closes, two Instagram closes. One number close was with a tall hot blonde in a gorgeous summer dress. We have a date set up for Monday. The other wasn’t as cute and I actually forgot to send the icebreaker so let it die. I also have not really been bothering with the Instagram closes (I didn’t message the one from day 4) though I should

Day 7:
4 approaches. No closes. Last approach was the uni student who said she was “taking a break from men for a while”

Day 8:
4 approaches. No closes. One was a lesbian and said it annoyed her how often she got approached as a polite way of saying fuck off.

Day 9:
5 approaches. One good interaction but she was waiting for her boyfriend.

Day 10:
4 approaches. One number close with gorgeous English chick (she took my number and called me so I knew it was legit). Shit tested me when I went for the number close (how many times do you do this a day?) and I agreed and amplfied (this is my 100th one today, I’m aiming for 200). She laughed. Didn’t respond to icebreaker. I think I didn't come off as genuine and it came across like I was just going through the same motions with her as I'd done with a million other chicks (which was true..)

Day 11:
4 approaches. No closes. These were kind of half assed. One of them was a good interaction I thought, but it was again a deep dive one that went nowhere. I opened asking her where the best coffee shops around were. She told me, then I said “that was part of the reason I came to talk to you, the other reason is I thought you were cute”. She said that was smooth. I did try teasing her when I asked where she was from and when she responded I said “ah that’s a shame, I only date girls from X”. But this was robotic, half assed and she gave a half hearted chuckle. (when I said “if it’s cool we should grab coffee”. She said “it’s not cool, I’m actually seeing someone”. Ouch.


So reading this, I had a hot streak the first few days. But I’ve found my hot streak has ended and the last couple of days and I’ve not been in state. The reason is now I want to open younger and more attractive chicks, but now I’m seeing the predictable “deep diving doesn’t work” and can see it playing out before my eyes, making me more hesitant to approach and when I do, the approaches are coming off as robotic and forced, and the girls are picking up on it. Another reason I'm more hesitant is because I also think my fundamentals, while impressing older women, are not quite at the point where younger women are impressed. A few years ago I was a lot bigger actually and got many more IOIs during the day, now gyms are closed, haven't lifted in a long time, but I am a lot leaner than I was due to working out at home. Leaner, but not as eye popping as I used to be. Got to work on building lean mass without becoming a fatass. This will take years if I don't want to get a beer gut in the process. I should note an interesting phenomenon though - I think I'm uglier during the day due to the sun hits my body at unflattering angles, emphasizing the size of my nose and other unattractive features). And at night I'm much more attractive. I feel this because in some situations, I have met girls during the day and they haven't taken a second glance, but meeting the same ones again at night they take a good look and are at a loss for words. Not bragging, this is just what I've observed. Again, easiest way to command more presence and attention during the day is with my body which needs to get bigger.

I have a date next week Monday, a tentative for Wednesday, and the woman I went on a date with yesterday wants to see me again. All these women are early 30s. All very sexy so not complaining! But I think I saw a post in Cientificos journal that said “game is about getting women younger than you and hotter than you”. The younger girls are generally disinterested and if we do get into a conversation, I am consistently getting the "I have a boyfriend" objection or similar. If I want to cultivate abundance mentality and consistently get top quality, I have to stop winging these interactions and start thinking of more scripts/routines to use as an anchor, off which I can freestyle and get them hooked.

 

[Beam]

Day 12:

4 approaches, no closes. I wouldn't say they were complete duds because I think my openers were good, however again, ran into the same problem of not spiking her emotions/things being too polite, not pushing the interaction forward well enough. In fact, I ejected myself from three of these interactions because I couldn't stand the awkwardness. The other one was single and on the fence but I qualified her too much and then she made up her mind and ejected herself "I'm going to leave now" I went out today while the sun was good, before I had sat down to plan out the interactions in more detail. I think at this point it may be better to take a bit of a break before resuming the challenge, while I do this. Otherwise I'm just spinning my wheels.

Approach 1:
Noticed a cute girl with a NASA jumper walking opposite me. Passed and looped back. Opener was strong. "Hey, I noticed you had a NASA jumper on and I had to come and find out if you were a space fan". Up close I noticed she was a lot younger even with the mask on (probably around 18, maybe even younger) so felt a bit weird. But she was really friendly and open:

H: "Haha, actually not really, I just liked the look of the jumper"
M: "Ah ok. See a lot of the time when people wear certain items of clothing it tells you something about their personality"
H: "Well, I do like space, it's beautiful" (qualifying herself?)
M: "It is, and it's even better when you're somewhere where there aren't any lights"
H: "Exactly! Like out in the center of the country"
M: "Too much light pollution around here. What are you getting up to today?" (logistics)
H: "I'm going to meet up with my friends"
M: (trying and failing to tease) "Ah, going on a bender with your friends now things have opened up again?"
H: *stared blankly, maybe she didn't know what a bender was*
M: "Now that bars have opened again a lot of people are finally going out and things are getting crazy" (ugh)
H: Yeah, haha *silence*
M: *silence*

At this point I ejected myself and said have an awesome time with your friends. She thanked me happily and went on her way. And facepalmed myself internally. See before I would have just hail maried for the number close but now I'm at the point where I can sense if I haven't sparked any actual attraction and I can predict what the outcome is going to be "I have a boyfriend" or flakey number. Until I think of routines this is a dead end.

Approach 2:
Inside the clothes store, passed a stunning brunette in a black dress, black hat, nice jewellery and so on. Ran back (an older couple next to me watching) and opened her strongly.

M: "Hey, I just had to come and tell you that you have the most fantastic outfit I've worn all day. I love how uniform it is with the black hat, black dress and accessories"
H: Genuinely surprised but happy "Oh haha, thank you! I wear black all the time though so it's not really special"
M: "Every day? I thought you were going to have a different colour for every day of the week"
H: "No! But honestly it's not that special"
M: "Well, what I've realized is that when someone is used to something, to them it's not that special because they see it all the time and are used to it, but to others it's novel."
H: "That's true"
M: "What are you getting up to today anyway?" (logistics)
H: "Just shopping around! What about you?"
M: Shopping as well (showed her my bags). Now things are open again I can't wait. And what's your name?
H: *irish name*
M: I've never heard anyone with that name before.
H: "It's Irish"
M: Man I've got to say, Irish girls are something else, really get me going (attempt to inject some sexuality into the conversation, but clunky. I feel like I'm praising her too much)
H: "Haha yeah, Irish and Scottish girls.

At this point I felt things stagnating a bit and I could sense her body was turned away (hadn't hooked but I think there was intrigue there). I felt the hail mary might've worked in this case because I wasn't sure how to take the interaction forward. So I set a false time constraint.

M: "Hey, I've got to run, but what do you say we grab a coffee sometime?" (again, have failed to qualify her) I know if you're reading this it seems quite sudden and too soon, but I think I did it quite confidently and naturally which is why she didn't outright reject me. I was speaking slowly and clearly.
H: *thinks for a moment*. What do you do for work?
M: Exaggerating "I'm a baller millionaire".
H: "haha"
M: No, I'm an engineer, in between jobs right now.
M: "(Teasing) - motioning a paper and pen "tick, got a job". I feel like you've got a checklist right now that you're just ticking off" with a big smile
H: "haha, no! I'm not quite sure what to say because this hasn't happened to me before, someone coming up to me like this, I don't know what to do. Ok, I just, I only date guys with a bachelors, at least"
M: "So if a high school grad who was amazingly sexy walked up to you, was charismatic and charming, you would say no?"
H: "Yes, I've spent the last 15 years falling for that. Not anymore. I worked as a University lecturer so that's why I have that requirement"
M: "University lecturer, lecturing what?"
H: "History and Psychology"
M: "As a history lecturer this must be a pretty interesting time to be living through"
H: "Oh yeah"
M: *at this point I could have kept going but I felt things were dragging and she was getting bored so I tried to get back on the topic of the date
M: "Where are you located"
H: "I live out *north*
M: "I live in *my location*. Lots of good cafes around there*
H: "Ah, I know *my location* well.
M: "Drink there all the time?"
H: "Haha no, just, living here a long time I've explored everywhere. Except *west*.
M: "What have you got against *west*
H: "It's just, dodgy"

*this is the point where I think I lost her by complimenting her too much. Conversation was boring anyway but I think she was still on the fence. This is where she made up her mind I think*

M: *I just noticed that her nails were black as well* "Wow, I just noticed even your nails are black. Your whole look is so integrated" (fail)
H: Paused for a bit, then politely said "I'm going to go now" (ouch).

Reading this back, I'm asking so many questions and not making enough statements. Reading this back, I like to fancy myself as a good conversationalist but I'm clearly not in these cases. Kind of cringeworthy. This is why I'm reluctant to continue four a day until I've got a proper plan in place. In this case, I praised her too much, didn't qualify her, didn't spike emotions or attraction. Played out as expected.

Important point to note though that could have influenced the outcome - since we were inside we both had our masks on. She never saw my face. I should have taken it off briefly for her to see but completely forgot.

Approach 3:
On the street, tall hot brunette. Passed and looped back

M: "Hey, I saw you and thought you looked fantastic, and had to come and say something"
H: "Aww, thank you"

From here, was basic boring questions (logistics, name). Predicted the outcome and ejected myself. She said bye, in a tone of "how adorable". Not how I want to be perceived, especially as she looked to be around mid 20s, my perfect age range.

Again, reading these interactions the openers don't seem special, but I believe my delivery is actually strong and genuine, possibly one aspect that I am getting better at.

Approach 4:
Asian girl in green top and white pants, walking in front of me. Decided to try an indirect and then go direct later.

M: (running up behind her) - "Hey, can you tell me where you got those pants from? They look great and I'd like to buy a pair for someone I know"
H: *unenthusiastically*. "Oh I got them from X"

At this point she pulled down her mask to adjust it briefly and I saw her full face. Decided to try a direct now.

M: "Wow, you're quite cute"
H: *unenthusiastically* "Thanks" - kept walking fast. I ejected.

In summary. I'm going to pause the challenge for now until I have an arsenal of conversational tools to use to spike emotion/attraction. Going to read terminator92s journal where Bismarck and a few others have put in suggestions for how to structure the interactions, as well as the responses to my question about the girl who said she was off men for a while.

The challenge has been good so far in that it has highlighted this sticking point for me and is making me able to see how the interactions are going to play out pretty predictably at this point. To the drawing board.

One good to come out of today is my openers were strong and felt natural again, and got me an in.

 

[Beam]

Also in a total coincidence, I saw Nike girl (girl I went on an instadate with and have a tentative set up for Wednesday with) TWICE today. I was in the tram going into the city and saw her on the street outside, and THEN on the tram back 2 hours later. SHE GOT ON THE SAME TRAM RIGHT IN FRONT OF ME. I called her name, she noticed me and immediately came over to sit down with me "Heyy". She started playing with her hair. I was getting off the next stop so couldn't chat for long before having to get off, but I laughed about how coincidental this was (she seemed unphased). I asked her what she was doing and she asked me, then I had to leave. Could have used a chase frame here "You're not stalking me are you".

This girl has been pretty flakey over text, and short. She doesn't strike me as a happy person, but she is compliant so I'm taking it where I can. I thought about sending a follow up text about the interaction afterwards, but thought against it. Thought that might be a bit forced and not texting might make her wonder, have already given away quite a bit of my power with her by my persistence with trying to get her out on a date already so am reigning it in.

 

[Beam]

General thoughts:

Saw this in Terminator92s journal - I'm not being polarizing enough.

When and How Much Should You Polarize?

Here’s a common issue I see guys run into: trying to decide how polarizing they should be. The general breakdown is: Beginners: polarize a LOT, across the board Journeymen: still polarize a lot, but start reeling it in and being more refined Advanced: polarize in small, controlled doses – use...

www.skilledseducer.com

Chase linked to this post within that post as well, which had an interesting tidbit:

To Chase - Did your Chinese jacket help or hinder?

Hello Chase, I've read about your Chinese jacket and how ditching it helped out in California. I have a Japanese inspired blazer that matches the size of my made-to-measure jacket exactly except for its straight cut down from the arm pit and am torn on getting it tailored (tucked in the waist)...

www.skilledseducer.com

You reach a point where you want to leave anything that sets off even a mild "this guy's peacocking" alarm off and instead opt entirely for outfits where someone looks at you and says, "You know, I don't know WHAT it is about that guy, as nothing in particular stands out, but he just looks AMAZINGLY cool." I wouldn't advise that until a guy is on the advanced side though because it reduces social touch points and makes you at once both more intimidating to approach and more likely to get cold shoulders and snubs if your attainability is not on point.

Something I did work on before approaching women from 19-24 was my fundamentals. I have a pretty decent style now (always room for improvement), but I don't have too many touch points. I always thought wearing jewellery and so on was try hard.. but now I've got and bought myself a pendant and a leather bracelet to wear.

Day 13

I wore an outlandish shirt today to see what sort of reaction it would gauge. To be honest, I don't think it was congruent and did come off as try hard. I felt like a clown tbh. And chickened out of approaching some real cuties because of it. But it was a good experience anyway.

Approach 1: Hired gun (very good interaction)
Went in to buy the leather bracelet. Cute attendant came to help me. We found the one I saw online - while she was opening it I was close to her on the side and noticed three dots on the index finger of both hands. I used this as the opener.

M: "Are those tattoos?"
H: "Yes!"
M: "I've never seen one like that before. It's very subtle and easy to miss!"

I won't detail the whole convo but will detail the important points. I actually talked to her about what Chase talked about above, about being subtle vs demanding attention with certain accessories. She was excitedly involved in the conversation saying that her style was subtle (like with the tattoos) and that she was trying to find more attention grabbing accessories. I shared my experiences and told her that's partly why I was wearing this shirt, as an experiment. I was slow, cool and calm in my speech.

I used putting on the bracelets as an excuse to have her touch my hand (she helped me get them on). I told her I was taking up all her time and she defended it fully "No! Before you came I was not doing anything, I'm glad I'm here"

We kept talking, moving around the store looking at other ones. I found out about her hobbies and so on. She was hooked. Once I had decided on a bracelet and we went to the counter, she asked me what I was doing for the rest of the day. I told her shopping around. Then she said "well if you need anything more from *the store we were at*, please come back and find me because I'll help you!". Shows how invested she was.

M: "Will do. Hey, this has been a fun conversation, I wouldn't mind continuing it sometime. What do you say we grab coffee at some point?"
H: *she gave genuine girly laugh "I'm flattered!" *she genuinely meant it*. "But I'm actually seeing someone. We've been together for a year now so I don't know what he would think. But I'm really flattered, I'm sorry!"
M: "Hey that's no stress, thought I'd put it out there" *went to check out*
H: "But really, is there something else you want? I can help you find it!"
M: "Actually, I was looking for rings too"
H: *she bolted up* "We don't have them", but then motioned for me to follow. She suddenly stopped. I think she was nervous in a good way and realized what she was doing (taking me to look for them when they didn't have any)
H: "Hmm. How about this, if we do have rings, I will let you know and personally look for them myself"

*this is where I decided to push the boundary a bit)

M: "How will you personally let me know if you have rings? I'd need contact details for that" *with a smirk*
M: "How about this, what do you say I grab your number, and we get a coffee as friends? I don't want to be a homewrecker of course"
H: *she started squirming and laughing like a little girl, stumbling over her words, she was really loving it*. "I caaaan't. I reaally can't. I'm sorry..."

Seeing this wasn't going anywhere, I said that was ok, and left, saying I may be back to find more accessories

Approach 2:
Cute asian girl in pink jacket and goth boots. I approached her to compliment her on the boots, but she didn't speak English very well and looked a bit uncomfortable so let her go.

Approach 3:
At traffic light, asked a girl where the nearest coffee shop was, she told me quickly and then the lights went green and rushed off. I'd hardly count this one tbh

Approach 4:
Sexy brunette wearing a blue pantsuit and sneakers.

Complimented her on the pantsuit "I had to say I love the outfit, it's one of the more interesting ones I've seen all day"
She laughed and thanked me.

I asked her about the style and if this was something she wore often, and then she started talking about the store she worked at and what they sold. I stopped her: "No, I mean your style"

She started saying this was a new style she was trying out, and brought up the fact she was wearing sneakers too with the outfit. I asked her what the reasoning was behind the trend I saw lately of girls wearing fashionable clothes and then sneakers. She gave me some spiel about them wanting to come off as fashionable but active at the same time. Didn't really rib her on this - tbh I think it's a horrible trend and I don't know what the women are thinking.

At some point it was clear she wanted to leave (she was working). When I sensed this my voice started to quicken. Again, this is something I've noticed - when I think the girl is not into me my voice pitch increases and I speak more quickly. So I let her go "well I'd like to keep chatting but you look like you're in a hurry, so I'll let you go". She then walked away and said "bye" in a matter of fact tone. I think she knew I was trying to hit on her at this point and didn't like it.


Summary:
Openers and delivery were strong and well received for the most part. I focused on slow speaking and eye contact. The interactions were natural, I pushed the boundary with hired gun by asking to still go out as friends after she mentioned the partner, to no avail. But will continue to do this.

Still working on gambits and stories to take the convo where I want it to go.

 

[Beam]

Date last night with the tall hot blonde was interesting. Found out she's actually my age, not early 30s like I had originally thought. Honestly, I'm not sure if she was that physically attracted to me, but I managed to have her cuddled up to me and making out a few hours in, while we each had only two drinks (she was driving). I managed to do this by keeping things light-hearted, using chase frames and compliance requests.

A few examples:

Chase Frames

*talking about google home*

H: “Do you have one of those small thingys”
M: H, what do you mean?? A small *motioning to my dick and making a circle around it* this?
H: *bursts out in laughter* Noo
M: “How do you know it’s small? Have you been stalking me? I feel so judged right now”
H: “Hahaha I’m not that brilliant. I mean Google Home Mini”

H: I love spin class. Especially getting to dress in lycra
M: “Are you trying to make me picture you in lycra right now? Clever girl”
H: *bursts out in laughter*

Compliance Request

I first requested to see her instagram (show me your instagram, I want to see it) when we were talking about social media. She refused.

The next one is the most important one and has been a bit of a game changer for me. The whole night we were sitting on benches at 90 degrees from one another, and quite far away. I could keenly feel the distance and formality. At many points when she laughed I couldn't touch her naturally because she was too far away. I decided to wait after we were done eating and there was a small pause in the conversation, then:

M: “I feel like there’s a lot of distance over here. What are you doing over there – come here!” tapping the bench right next to me.
H: Haha, what about the 1.5m rule? Well, I don’t have COVID, and I hope you don’t have COVID *as she sidled up next to me with a big smile. I put my arm around her.

Immediately I felt the state shift. She wasn’t a big scary girl all the way over there any more who was not attracted to me and was only here to be polite before going home and saying "sorry but I didn't feel the connection", here she was in my arms smiling.

We kept talking some more. I brought up a mask gambit I developed (that I can only use now but may be able to use in the future if the topic of COVID ever comes up) to sexualize again. In summary the gambit is me asking her whether the masks have caused her to check out other features of guys now, like their bodies, fashion style, eyes. This leads into us talking about how lips have become the forbidden fruit now, and that we have started sexualizing them like they sexualized ankles back in the day (this got a good laugh).

I also made a conscious choice to move my face very close to hers and look at her lips on occasion.

I don't remember exactly what we were talking about that led up to it, but this led to us kissing. I broke it off, she had a big smile on her face and gave a little girlish laugh while looking into my eyes afterwards. I'll never forget that look - this hot tall fashionable blonde I saw walking down the street and here she was in my arms looking at me like this after kissing her. Can only imagine what it would be like after sleeping with her. And all because I cold approached her.

Soon after she told me she had to leave since she had to help her sister move her washing machine. We had a good laugh about this and she said "I know it sounds bullshit but it's legit! I'll send you a picture". I told her that was a shame since we could have watched *show we were talking about* together.

We got up - I only realized how tall she was now really. I had boots which add almost two inches to my height, she had sneakers on and was still taller than me. We paid, I made sure to use protective touch (hand on her lower back) while walking through the bar and crossing the street.

We both had our masks on - when saying goodbye she asked "what do we do now with the masks". I said "I want to take the mask off honestly". So I did, she did and we kissed quickly. She texted me the image of the washing machine.

I've sent a follow up text today saying I had fun last night and would like to see her again. I honestly don't know if she will respond. Even though she was compliant, like I said I'm not sure if she was that physically attracted so this could go any way.

Either way, just goes to show the power of this tech that I've been ignorant off this whole time. Amazing how you can read this site for ages, but still miss some crucial info that can make or break the interactions. For this reason I've started reading the book "How to make girls chase". I feel like reading a book end to end will help create a baseline understanding that I can build off, rather than what I've been doing which has pretty much been winging it, failing, then reading a specific article about what I could have done differently.

 

[Beam]

Also, Day 14

Summary, 6 approaches, 1 number close. A cute brunette with bright blue eyes. I feel the number is a strong one since she was talking a lot, asking me a lot of questions and so on. She's just moved to the area too so might be more open to having someone show her around.

Main takeaways from the failures - most of them were pretty quick blow offs. I'm not persisting to the point where she says "fuck off". When I sense she wants to leave I'm letting her go without any persistence. Again, fundamentals need work. Back a couple of years I was quite buff and got IOIs from hot chicks but my face looked fat (and I was too pussy to approach), now I'm leaner (still no six pack) and my face is a lot more handsome. Gyms have opened again so can start lifting hard again.

I find I'm still chickening out of approaching some really really hot chicks (and only if they're younger, I'm not as afraid of opening them if they look older, case in point today one of my approaches was tall, blonde and honestly looked like fashion model). She was polite and we chatted for a bit but she sped up quickly to leave after a short while and I didn't persist. The ones I'm afraid of are still the ones who I remember never giving me the time of day growing up. That old insecurity which doesn't want to die.

 

[Beam]

Got hit with this in response to my text to tall hot blonde - the oh too familiar:

H: "Hey M, *response to inside joke*, haha! Thank you for a really nice night last night. I have to be honest with you, I've recently gotten out of a relationship and it's just a bit too soon for me to start dating again. I appreciate you coming up to me in the street randomly on a whim and you seem like a really great person. All the best with your new job! Xx"

I sent this response (a Fluxcapacitor suggestion)

M: "Hey H, that's no problem. Its a shame of course, we'd have had a lot of fun. Let me know if you ever want to hang out at some point in the future. And good luck for *inside joke*, haha"

Bit of a bummer.

Piecing together why it happened. Fundamentals need work. She also mentioned during the date that I seemed "quietly confident". Perhaps I could have been louder to match her as she was an extravert. Lover value needs to be upped of course so I'm disqualified as a boyfriend. Need to hit gym harder.

No response to the icebreaker text from the number close today, also no date tomorrow with Nike girl, she flaked.

In some good news, I do still have a date tomorrow night - second date with the one who came over to mine friday. Spanish food in the city. Will segue that into cooking and then suggest cooking something at mine when she gets back from her holiday.

Soldier on, soldier on, despite setbacks.. this is a long hard game.[/quote][/quote]

 

[Beam]

My response to HB Hot Blonde was well received, thanks @Fluxcapacitor (this was your suggestion in response to a similar text I got a few months back):

H: "Thanks for understanding. I'd like that perhaps later down the track... I'm sure we'll have some good conspiracy theories to exchange too ;P" (we talked about conspiracy theories at one point)

To which I responded:

M: My door is always open to hearing the latest wacky ones! Bye for now"

Where to from here:

Of course I'm 99% certain that she won't initiate again. However, I'm going to experiment with pinging (which I usually don't do)

What I am going to do is, if I come across a crazy conspiracy theory in a few months (or if I don't, I will find one on Wikipedia and "pretend" to have stumbled across it, I will send her a text telling how about it and how it reminded me of our conversation a couple months back and ask her how she has been travelling. This will hopefully bring back the positive emotions and reinitiate conversation so I can get her out again.

I used a positive reengagement text like this with Nike girl a few weeks back after she hadn't responded to my text for 5 days. Since I opened her about her outfit, and she responded saying she could be the Nike brand ambassador, I feigned walking past a Nike store and sent this:

M: Hey *NikeGirl, it's M! I passed a Nike store today and remembered our little rendezvous - the lines were so long I'm not sure they're going to need a brand ambassador anymore. How has your week been tracking so far?

She responded within minutes, which is where we made tentative plans.

I thought she had flaked, but I sent another text and she responded saying she may be down for a walk, so that may be happening today.

Main Takeaway:

In any interaction (date, first approach) pick something funny that you have talked about - as long as it is cemented with positive emotions - and use a reference to it in the future ("I was passing a Nike store, I came across a crazy conspiracy theory") to reengage her if things end.

Always be leaving floods of positive emotion wherever you go.

 

[Científico]

Keep up the great work Mooser. I'm extracting some lessons myself here from reading what you write.

 

[Beam]

Thanks man! Great to hear. I've gotten lessons from yours as well - One example is I've used your "it's my job to lead, your job to resist" line a couple times when she has tried getting my number now - it's good bouncing off each other.

 

[Beam]

Updates. Went on a coffee/walking date with Nike girl yesterday. Will write up a proper FR at some point - in summary, invited her to cook a meal and mine and she agreed - so will get her schedule soon to do that. Overall, I could have been more dominant and sort of let her take the lead (she wanted to go to a specific doughnut place and said she was going anyway with or without me). I honestly didn't mind walking but it felt a bit weird. I initiated touch multiple times - she told me she hates when people touch her and that the only person she lets touch her is a partner. I continued to do it and at the end gave her a hug (should have gone for a kiss on the cheek). I probably made tons of mistakes on this one that hopefully the FR will highlight.

Also went on the second date with T (who came to mine on the first date). We had dinner in the city, and I planned the next date (her coming to mine to cook a meal) for next Saturday (she's going away for a week and that's when she's next available, which is a bit of a shame that it's so far away).

Cute brunette who didn't respond to my icebreaker greeted me this morning asking about my day - I responded as per the text sequence (greeting her, showing concern for her, sharing a bit about myself, then asking her how hers was coming along)

When she responds, I will ask her schedule and set up a coffee date (which is what she agreed to in person)

Didn't hit my target of 4 approaches yesterday. With more self discipline I probably could have done it but I think not hitting it but having two fairly long dates is a fair trade.

 

[Beam]

Day 15:

7 approaches, no dice. Ejected out of one because she was older than I thought but she opened up immediately and wanted to keep chatting, one other hot Bolivian told me she wasn't interested, the others I wasn't persistent enough and/or didn't make my interest clear. Not happy with how easily I've been bowing out.

Trying to figure out why I'm feeling this way. Again, part of it is a nagging feeling that I know how the situation is going to play out based on previous reference experiences with girls who look like that which is affecting my desire to persist (and thinking I should *wait* until fundamentals/conversation have improved - irrational silly thought - part of it is because I'm afraid of "running out" of girls (if I approach too much, I'll get recognized, the girls will recognize me and I won't be able to approach them again because they'll remember me even after I've improved my fundamentals). Silly and irrational but that's what's been going through my head. Part is because of the easy hooks I previously got early on making me a bit lazier and bowing out of sets where the girl doesn't get into the conversation immediately. Ego preservation getting in the way.

 

[Beam]

Day 16:

6 approaches,

1 blowout, 1 quick thanks and bolt, 3 polite conversations, 1 number close (weak)

Summary:
Experimented with a new type of indirect opener that also sort of works as a direct. I have been having trouble finding specific compliments to use for certain fashionable items (pants, tops etc)

So what I tried today was the following (previously used a couple of days ago):

M: “Excuse me, I saw those boots/pants/top, they look great and my cousin was looking for one very similar – where did you get it?”
H: "Oh I got it from X". If it was from another country (like one of the women today got it from France)

From here I branched out, talking about her time in France blah blah, until I hit her with this:

M: "Great, actually it's not just the boots/pants/top that looks good, you have an overall great sense of style"
H: "Haha, oh thanks"

However what I'm finding is that my sexual intent is still not clear enough - coming across as too friendly, so when I sense things are coming to a close and she's expecting it to end I've been saying

M: "Actually the boots/pants/top was only part of the reason I stopped, the main reason is I thought you were cute and had to say something"

The woman I number closed intimidated the hell out of me. Tall, fashionable. I opened complimenting her on her handbag (it looked like it was made of baubles), then branched out (it's not just the handbag, you have a great sense of style)

She was in shock, and I was so nervous I was mumbling quite a bit. Composed myself somewhat, asked her what she was up to (logistics) - she was getting props for work. Kept chatting, when I sensed things were starting to die down I then said "Actually the boots/pants/top was only part of the reason I stopped you, the main reason is I thought you were cute and had to say something"

She paused and thanked me. We chatted some more and then I asked if she'd like to get a coffee sometime. She paused, then asked me what I did. I told her (engineer, new job starting in a few weeks) and then she gave me her number.

Reason I think it was weak is I hardly qualified her, stumbled over my words and realized I had the stupid mask on the entire time so she couldn't see my face. Not expecting a response but again my mind is blown, because it is further reinforcing the fact that girls this attractive are open to my advances.

 

[terminator92]

Day 16:

6 approaches,

1 blowout, 1 quick thanks and bolt, 3 polite conversations, 1 number close (weak)

Summary:
Experimented with a new type of indirect opener that also sort of works as a direct. I have been having trouble finding specific compliments to use for certain fashionable items (pants, tops etc)

So what I tried today was the following (previously used a couple of days ago):



From here I branched out:



However what I'm finding is that my sexual intent is still not clear enough - coming across as too friendly, so when I sense things are coming to a close and she's expecting it to end I've been saying



The woman I number closed intimidated the hell out of me. Tall, fashionable. I opened complimenting her on her handbag (it looked like it was made of baubles), then branched out (it's not just the handbag, you have a great sense of style)

She was in shock, and I was so nervous I was mumbling quite a bit. Composed myself somewhat, asked her what she was up to (logistics) - she was getting props for work. Kept chatting, when I sensed things were starting to die down I then said "Actually the boots/pants/top was only part of the reason I stopped you, the main reason is I thought you were cute and had to say something"

She paused and thanked me. We chatted some more and then I asked if she'd like to get a coffee sometime. She paused, then asked me what I did. I told her (engineer, new job starting in a few weeks) and then she gave me her number.

Reason I think it was weak is I hardly qualified her, stumbled over my words and realized I had the stupid mask on the entire time so she couldn't see my face. Not expecting a response but again my mind is blown, because it is further reinforcing the fact that girls this attractive are open to my advances.

Hey @Mooser I hit you up in a private message check it out! Here you seem to be doing a semi-direct kind of open and then when the conversation seems to be dying trying to go direct as a way to save the conversation. Not really the best time to hit on a girl, when she is already thinking of exiting the conversation and it has turned stale. There was a stage in which I was doing this too. And it really did not get me any results. We can discuss further on a private chat

 

[Beam]

Hey @Mooser I hit you up in a private message check it out! Here you seem to be doing a semi-direct kind of open and then when the conversation seems to be dying trying to go direct as a way to save the conversation. Not really the best time to hit on a girl, when she is already thinking of exiting the conversation and it has turned stale. There was a stage in which I was doing this too. And it really did not get me any results. We can discuss further on a private chat

Hey man, yeah I know I shouldn't be doing it when it's starting to die - I'm trying to make my intentions clear faster (and smoother). It actually worked with one girl who I instadated and went on a subsequent date with (and I'm pretty sure wants to see me again) but of course it's not best practice. Sure, would like that!

 

[Beam]

Quick brain dump before bed:

Finding that I am very much drawn to the Grandmaster style/A2DaMIR style of game above all others and feel it is the most congruent to my personality and look. Goal here is to weave this style into all my interactions (already improving with chase frames but still miss opportunities to chase frame on occasion)

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Tactics Tuesdays: A2daMIR-Style Banter and Frame Control

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Secrets to Getting Girls: Chase Framing

Alright gentlemen, if you feel like fishing with dynamite, I’m going to show you how in this post on Chase Framing. This is how to get girls to chase you. If your goal is women pursuing you, women chasing after you, women trying to sleep with you… chase framing is the closest thing to a magic...

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