Opposites attract? I approached hot girls, here are findings!

Indian Race Troll (IRT)

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So David Deida talked about this in book regarding hotter and colder women but I wanted to expand on it.

So a while ago I played around with the idea of an experiment where I would approach 10 hot blondes and redheads while also approaching 10 hot darker skinned brunettes (mainly Caucasian).

The reason?

As a white guy with dark hair who tans easily (get told I look like Jon Bernthal a lot), I noticed that natural redheads, blondes and pale brunettes (as in really white) seemed to show the most interest in me. Now I also found that women of minority groups like Asian, black and to an extent Indian loved me too. Of all the groups, I was getting the least attention from my type, white women with dark hair and slightly tanned skin. Then I wondered if it was confirmation bias or what but I noticed that I ran into a lot of couples in which the kinds of hot girls I liked were with a pale blond guy and the like (e.g.: Look at Emily Ratajkowski and her trollish looking husband).

I noticed a bit of a trend where hot blondes and redheads would go for dark haired men and minorities while brunette hotties would more commonly go for blond guys.

So I decided to approach at least 10 hot girls of each group, then decided that there is no way that is enough, so I approached around 25 or so over a period of a couple months.

The standards were simple, if she was slim and had a pretty face, I was going to approach. Here are the findings after 50 or so approaches.

Cultural upbringing > phenotype and her look.

I found that I had a pretty good experience with brunettes from more rural American backgrounds and more conservative southern areas. My thoughts are for one, a guy with my kind of look is either slightly exotic or my look is neutral. I find myself having more success with women from this kind of a background anyways, usually they are blondes but I have been with brunettes like this as well so it made more sense when I did the approach.

Yesterday night at a bar I approached this brunette beauty, dark hair with blue eyes and a tan. She was from South Carolina and things were going well but she kindly let me down as her boyfriend arrived, her boyfriend was a buff Hispanic guy that looked like Aaron Hernandez but I went away safe. The guy and I had a laugh and he understood that things happen.

So what kinds of brunettes and tanned skin white women do have a similar mindset towards male beauty as Hitler did?

I find that this is probably the most true for Italian women and Mediterranean women in general. One my cousins is a blond guy who went to Spain, said he was shooting blanks after a couple weeks there. On the other hand one of my friends is a Middle Eastern guy who is a natural that cleaned up in Hungary and Denmark, in Spain he was incel.

My thoughts are that white women from cultural groups that aren’t perceived as being white enough but take whiteness very seriously tend to have some self-hate. Now this is why you commonly see good looking Mediterranean women with blond men, even though a lot of these men often look trollish. Does not matter, the mindset is that they get to surround themselves with whiteness and be around whiteness, putting them mentally at ease.

I think this is also why you hear of minorities cleaning up in a place like Scandinavian or some of the more blonde Eastern European countries but struggling in the Mediterranean.

Could it be confirmation bias too? Maybe but I think there is something there.

Maybe if I see a sexy Mediterranean looking girl or a Catherine Zeta Jones type of chick with a dark haired guy or a minority, I don’t notice? Maybe I just notice it more when I see a darker guy with a blonde or redhead compared to a Megan Fox lookalike even more. That very well could be the case as it was with the South Carolina girl I approached.

Then again I am left asking about how it ended up that way. Maybe the blond guy just showed up and she was all over his dick while the Cristiano Ronaldo lookalike had to work more for it, comparatively speaking. At this point, we are doing mental gymnastics.

The point of my thread is that it is common enough to not be ignored. I have seen enough cases of it to think there must be something going on right?

My results? No definite conclusion yet, maybe I need to approach more?

Just as easily, I noticed I was running into a lot of stuck up blondes and even redheads too. After really doing it in terms of making the approaches, there was not that much of an overlap. Bitchy girls were bitchy girls and receptive girls were receptive girls. Where there was overlap was on dating apps where looks mean everything, in that case I matched with a lot of blondes and redheads but not nearly as many brunettes.

Where the overlap did happen was culture itself. If she was from an ethnic background like Mediterranean, then I do feel she might be more hostile towards darker guys but if it was a more WASPy or Slavic brunette, I feel that the hostility died down. Which makes me think of one of my Arab friends who is dating this Russian HB9 with dark hair, green eyes and tanned skin.

So what about it?

At the end, as men we want women who will be most receptive to us and we want the highest return on investment in our game. My proposal is simple with that in mind, simply go for the look you like but be weary of culture.

So lets say you’re like me and the raven haired look makes your dick go crazy, then go for a girl from Eastern Europe or maybe even a Northern European brunette who is either going to be impartial or maybe even like your swarthy look. Don’t go for women from cultures that have a lot of self-hate towards their look and want to desperately get whiter, this would include all of the Mediterranean.
 

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Tool-Bearing Hominid
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Proactivity said:
So David Deida talked about this in book regarding hotter and colder women but I wanted to expand on it.
To get the most out of your post I thought to re-read this chapter from his book thoroughly - then I go on with your post, how about that? I've read his book a couple of years ago. I still remember some main concepts, most what was relevant to me at that time/on a first read. (And I was partly frustrated by his advice basically not to approach. OK, then how do you get into a relationship; a relationship of any kind in the first place? It just didn't add up.)

So Proactivity, which chapter was the one you refer to in Deida's book? Maybe 24) Choose a Woman Who Is Your Complementary Opposite? Maybe another one.
 

Chase

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Proactivity said:
So what kinds of brunettes and tanned skin white women do have a similar mindset towards male beauty as Hitler did?

lmao

I've gotta say, the nice thing about forums is they never get old.

Proactivity said:
I find that this is probably the most true for Italian women and Mediterranean women in general. One my cousins is a blond guy who went to Spain, said he was shooting blanks after a couple weeks there. On the other hand one of my friends is a Middle Eastern guy who is a natural that cleaned up in Hungary and Denmark, in Spain he was incel.

The problem is not the ethnicity of the women. The problem is the aggressiveness of the men.

Spain, Italy, and Greece are three of the hardest countries to game the local women in on the planet, from what everyone has told me. Regardless what you look like, they are hard, hard, hard.

The reason is not because they want men of a certain look. As you've noticed, guys with all kinds of different looks struggle there.

The reason is because the men there are VERY aggressive, and the dating market is highly competitive:


Proactivity said:
My thoughts are that white women from cultural groups that aren’t perceived as being white enough but take whiteness very seriously tend to have some self-hate. Now this is why you commonly see good looking Mediterranean women with blond men, even though a lot of these men often look trollish. Does not matter, the mindset is that they get to surround themselves with whiteness and be around whiteness, putting them mentally at ease.

There's some accuracy to this.

Dark skinned women want to mix with light skinned men. Light skinned women want to mix with dark skinned men.

The ideal in the West is a kind of lightly tanned skin. When you consider that, just put it in your head that "every Western woman I meet is trying to make her children closer to that shade in the next generation" and you've got it. If your skin tone will move her closer toward her goal, you have an advantage with her. If it will move her farther from it, disadvantage. This is why pasty pale guys on the whole have it harder in the West with lighter skinned women than they do with women with a darker hue. While darker white men have it easier with lighter skinned women than they do with women of a darker hue.

In Asia, the ideal is very light skin. Which is a big reason why white guys (whose skin is almost always whiter than the locals') can do so well there. While dark skinned guys struggle.

In Scandinavia, the ideal right now is dark skin. Which is a big reason dark skinned guys often have such a big advantage in Nordic countries.

ALL THAT SAID... skin color is merely one attraction factor. The worse your fundamentals and game are, the more important a factor for you it is. The better the other stuff is, the less important it is relative to everything else you have going on.

As a pale redhead guy, I struggled for a long time with light-skinned women. To the point where for a while I just avoided approaching them at all because it was never worthwhile to do. However, at this point in my life, pale blondes and redheads are receptive to me as other types of women because I've advanced myself to the point where skin shade is too minor (compared to everything else I have going on) to make much of a difference:

How Many Attraction Factors are There? Infinite

So -- yes. Skin shade matters in attraction.

Does it matter to the point of obsession? Only if you're not trying to improve in other areas a lot.

Is it helpful to recognize? Yes, I suppose. I avoided pale-skinned women for a long time because those interactions just never went well. Now I love to talk to them as much as I love to talk to any girl because my prospects with a pale-skinned girl are as good as any other. But back when I still had a lot of work to do game- and fundamentals-wise, sure -- I avoided the women I did not do well with, and focused on the ones I did. Why? More positive reference points, more opportunities to progress further in the interaction / work on later game stuff / get laid / take girlfriends. And only so much time you have to approach.

If you're a white or Latin guy with a tan, you're the ideal, skin-wise, and may have never witnessed the weird phenomenon of girls discriminating by skin shade.

However, if you're pale, or you're dark, you'll see this. Pale girls don't like pale guys, they like tan and dark guys. Dark girls don't like dark guys, they like pale and tan guys.

But -- again -- this only matters at the intermediate-on-down levels of game and fundamentals. Past a certain point, it mostly ceases to matter (because at that point, she realizes there's a lot more her offspring gain from reproducing with you aside from skin shade. Always think of it as "What total gene package do women perceive me as offering to them?" and you will get it right -- sex is, after all, ultimately about reproduction; she wants to let cocks into her that will produce superior offspring).

Proactivity said:
Just as easily, I noticed I was running into a lot of stuck up blondes and even redheads too. After really doing it in terms of making the approaches, there was not that much of an overlap. Bitchy girls were bitchy girls and receptive girls were receptive girls. Where there was overlap was on dating apps where looks mean everything, in that case I matched with a lot of blondes and redheads but not nearly as many brunettes.

Good observations. The more heavily looks play a role in your evaluation as a mate, the bigger a role your skin shade will play. The more you can downplay the role of looks (such as in a cold approach, where your personality plays a far bigger role than online), the less important it becomes.

Proactivity said:
So lets say you’re like me and the raven haired look makes your dick go crazy, then go for a girl from Eastern Europe or maybe even a Northern European brunette who is either going to be impartial or maybe even like your swarthy look. Don’t go for women from cultures that have a lot of self-hate towards their look and want to desperately get whiter, this would include all of the Mediterranean.

It is not self-hate. Unless you think the Eastern or Northern European brunette who shags you is also doing it out of "self-hate."

It is an attempt to achieve offspring with a different skin shade closer to what is, at the moment, the regional ideal.

Chase
 

Indian Race Troll (IRT)

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Chase as we move on as a society, looks are going to matter more for men moving forward. Women have less of an incentive to rely on a guy for his paycheck and money and are more looks conscious in a man, we are going more towards a dating app culture as well where so much of dating is going online. That was more of the assumption of my thread as well as this post itself, the fact that looks matter a lot and I was going off of that premise. If we were going heavily based on looks how much this sort of thing would matter.

Game and personality obviously matter, you can't close the deal without them, but I am a guy with kind of an ego. If a hot blonde is treating me better but I feel like I have to actually work hard to prove myself to a hot girl with dark hair and tanned skin, then I just think it is the best use of my time to game women who will be inclined to be more receptive to my look. In other words I love girls that love me and even if I was to pull a Megan Fox from social circle game, I would still not be as into her if I knew that she was initially not as much into me and it took saying the right words or having the right game to pull her. In some ways I applaud you for still going after pale women after all that, no knock on just trying it lol.

For me it is about where I can get the highest return on investment. If gaming hot blondes means I am more likely to score and get higher quality, then obviously my time is better spent there than trying to go for women who are initially turned off by my type of look.

As for you talking about the beauty standard, I think it has changed concerning men in recent years Chase!

I look around at a lot of the biggest stars in Hollywood and they are mostly blond hair white men even though blond hair is not that common compared to dark hair, Cesar Romeros are the things of the past. Not sure what brought about the recent surge but blond haired men are promoted a lot as leads in films these days, love interests and even on modeling ads. Even the infamous Chad Thundercock meme that has gone viral is a muscular blond guy and not the Clark Kent phenotype. I won't be surprised if a few years from now, blond and red haired men become the top of the sexual desirability hierarchy and white guys although I'd argue blond men already are in the US at least.

My thoughts are that it isn't really based off of something like adhering to any beauty standard though, a lot of women do come from cultures that discriminate a lot and worship a certain ideal based off of things like power and Hitler-style race theories.

I am going to use Mediterranean women as an example. A lot of these women come from countries that aren't usually the friendliest towards refugees and immigrants, they take their whiteness seriously. Even in the US, tell an Italian American they aren't white and a fight is breaking out while an American of a more Northern European or blond haired background will laugh the joke off. Then add to that the fact that unlike Anglo and Scandinavian cultures, Mediterranean culture is quite shallow and judgmental.

You might say that the men are aggressive but I think that competitive factor goes away if the guy is blond and looks like a viking due to how those cultures work. That is why you see a lot of guys from places like Holland and Northern Europe slaying in Spain, because of that inherent self-hatred and insecurity Mediterranean people have towards being on the darker end of white.

So you take a woman raised in this sort of a culture, she is immediately going to do what women naturally do, try to fit in with what is cool and desirable. She is not trying to make a baby that is society's ideal, she wants her blond angel she can carry around and brag about to all of her friends.

For a woman raised in some cultures, it is cool and desirable to chase handsome guys with shredded abs and good looks.

For other women, things in their culture like your style, look and those sorts of things take precedence.

This is why I notice I can see a French, western or Northern European brunette that is stunning with a minority and the Aryan ideal is not that important for them. It even puzzles me why I see hot Slavic brunettes hooking up with darker skinned guys given how Eastern Europe is known for being racist but maybe it is because those countries are more poor than their western counterparts.
 

Indian Race Troll (IRT)

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I have kind of seen the same myself when looking at Instagram accounts of hot girls and just seeing who hot girls in general go for. The one idea I can definitely agree with on this thread is that the more pale and whiter looking a beauty is, the more likely she is to go interracial. Contrary to the whiny minorities on this forum I actually see a lot of hot blondes with guys that are not white themselves. Just from observing night game I can say that there is definitely a large number of blondies that love darker dick whether it is from a black, latino and these days even Asian and brown boys.

The one exception to the dark haired white girls going interracial part I have seen a lot of is Eastern European and Jewish women. It used to puzzle me as to why I see so many Jewish beauties fucking around with minorities but much less common for me to see Italian American women do given that I used to live in an area that had both. Then after hanging out with one too many Italian Americans, I notice how openly racist the guys were.

Italian Americans are not all PC and self-righteous like your typical WASP or Jew, most of them have a lot of stock in their whiteness given how some still do not consider them white. The guys definitely go for women of other races but resort to mate-guarding when someone games their women although they're more okay if their women go for other whites. What they definitely don't like is when a black dude starts getting with some of their women, already seen two fights break out over it. A lot of other minorities are also huge no nos for them.

What does differ a bit here is I've seen women straight out of Italy go for black, brown and even Asian guys. The same hangups that Italian American women have a lot of women straight from Italy do not seem to have.

I will have to side with culture and cultural trends here as I believe that women can be taught to be attracted to any given type. In my life I've seen sexy dark haired white girls reject a handsome blond guy and go for a black guy or minority instead.
 

Space

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Space said:
Proactivity said:
So David Deida talked about this in book regarding hotter and colder women but I wanted to expand on it.
To get the most out of your post I thought to re-read this chapter from his book thoroughly - then I go on with your post, how about that? I've read his book a couple of years ago. I still remember some main concepts, most what was relevant to me at that time/on a first read. (And I was partly frustrated by his advice basically not to approach. OK, then how do you get into a relationship; a relationship of any kind in the first place? It just didn't add up.)

So Proactivity, which chapter was the one you refer to in Deida's book? Maybe 24) Choose a Woman Who Is Your Complementary Opposite? Maybe another one.
So Proactivity, do you mind sharing which chapter in Deida's book inspired your post? I'm eager to re-read it, so I can join your discussion! You know, I have to know what are you talking about in the first place. It makes sense, doesn't it?

On the other hand I also find it possible that other posters in your thread have also no clue which chapter of Deida's book inspired your post - but then I don't see much point in debating about - what exactly?

Buried in this topic I've written my thoughts about what I got out of David Deida in regards to opposites attract each other. More precisely, masculine men and feminine women, and more feminine men and more masculine women. All in all, I'm a little puzzled that statistically I read here that many claim careerist (aka. more masculine) women as their genre of high quality women.
 

Indian Race Troll (IRT)

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I think Deida talked more about the kinds of way more women act so mixup on my end there.

So I've been walking around in the city I am currently visiting for a couple weeks, world class city for sure. One thing I have definitely noticed is that darker featured Caucasian women are head over heels crazy for guys who look like Chase and blonde men as well. With women of minority groups though, despite the stereotypes about Asian women hating their own men, I feel like it isn't really that crazy of a worship anymore. I do notice that minorities these days have more unity and preference in their own unless a lot of money is involved or the girl is clearly a gold digger/status queen.

It's strange but I do think that white people have some serious issues going on with self-hatred or at least hating their own kind of experience slightly. Whites with darker features might possibly be the most racist group and I can tell that most tanned brunettes, no matter how hot they are, are inherently insecure. I think this is why you will see Emily Ratajkowski with a trollish looking guy but he is blond so it doesn't matter. Same reason Irina Shayk probably left Cristiano Ronaldo for an overrated actor who is a poor man's Leonardo DiCaprio.

This is something to dig deeper into and I don't think it is as much of a wanting the kid to look like that tanned shade. If you think about it, a woman with dark hair and tanned skin will make a kid with those features if she mates with a guy that has dark hair and tanned skin. That right there would be the beauty ideal but the same women would prefer a blond or pale guy over a guy who is society's ideal (tall dark and handsome). My thoughts are there isn't any goal of raw attraction or anything, darker featured whites are inherently full of more self-hatred, it is why Hitler looked up so much to the blond hair blue eyed ideal.

One other thing, anyone notice that the value of blond men has shot through the roofs?
 

Space

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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Proactivity-

Proactivity said:
I think Deida talked more about the kinds of way more women act so mixup on my end there.
Is it your answer to me? I'm not sure. But I have a hard time decoding the above sentence and transcribe it to plain English. English isn't my native language.

Long story short, do you reveal to us to which chapter of Deida's book do you refer to? So we can re-read it and get on the same page, literally, as you. :) At least, when I speak for myself.
 

Space

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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Proactivity said:
Think its way of superior man or something
Yes, the book is called The Way of the Superior Man. Proactivity, is that your answer to my question...?
Space said:
To get the most out of your post I thought to re-read this chapter from his book thoroughly - then I go on with your post, how about that? I've read his book a couple of years ago. I still remember some main concepts, most what was relevant to me at that time/on a first read. (And I was partly frustrated by his advice basically not to approach. OK, then how do you get into a relationship; a relationship of any kind in the first place? It just didn't add up.)

So Proactivity, which chapter was the one you refer to in Deida's book? Maybe 24) Choose a Woman Who Is Your Complementary Opposite? Maybe another one.
Fair enough. You probably don't remember the chapter. So I will never know what you discussed with Chase here as I don't remember the race issue ever came up in that book. It's OK.

Speaking of opposites attract, I remember this, though:
Space said:
Buried in this topic I've written my thoughts about what I got out of David Deida in regards to opposites attract each other. More precisely, masculine men and feminine women, and more feminine men and more masculine women. All in all, I'm a little puzzled that statistically I read here that many claim careerist (aka. more masculine) women as their genre of high quality women.
 

Indian Race Troll (IRT)

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I was referencing the chapter where he talked about how brunettes are typically feistier and blondes have more of a cold demeanor, Asian girls have a cold demeanor too.
 

Space

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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Proactivity said:
I was referencing the chapter where he talked about how brunettes are typically feistier and blondes have more of a cold demeanor, Asian girls have a cold demeanor too.
Nonetheless, I'm glad you guys were able to have a long, back and forth debate about this without clarifying the actual chapter title/number for all the others. The book has 51 short, numbered chapters.

Anyway, I didn't plan to read the whole thing again now, but if it's only one chapter for group learning and discussion, why not? If anyone can identify the chapter title/number by Proactivity's description, I'm still in.
 

Space

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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To get the most out of your post I thought to re-read this chapter from his book thoroughly - then I go on with your post, how about that? I've read his book a couple of years ago. I still remember some main concepts, most what was relevant to me at that time/on a first read. (And I was partly frustrated by his advice basically not to approach. OK, then how do you get into a relationship; a relationship of any kind in the first place? It just didn't add up.)

So Proactivity, which chapter was the one you refer to in Deida's book? Maybe 24) Choose a Woman Who Is Your Complementary Opposite? Maybe another one.
As it's race thread season again I had to dig up this old one I'm still eager to find out what the heck are you talk about to begin with as the thread at least started to be about intriguing author David Deida LOL. It's interesting that you guys can have this long discussion but I still don't know what's the deal here in the first place.
 
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