My Lack of Planning - Advice Needed

Hey guys,

Went out for the second time with a girl I know from my work today. She's a virgin, not sexually experienced at all (she's only seen a dick, never touched one), and her last relationship was a few years ago. She's a cute girl who can be a bit shy (but is getting better at being more outgoing). She lives with her grandparents and her grandma knows about me and she tells her friends about me, but I'm a secret from her grandpa. Anyways, I had her come to my place (my parents place) and drive with me in my car to a nearby frisbee golf park since it was super nice today and we had previously talked about it.

We had good conversation and I wore shorts since it was nice out (and I had planned on getting somewhat sexual). We teased each other as we played and then went and got food at a nearby eatery. She talked a lot and seemed to be having fun, but after a while I started to get kind of bored. My dad also was bugging me to introduce her, which I wasn't thrilled about because I don't want to set the wrong expectations not having had sex with her yet. Plus my parents are aware that I've been going out on dates with different girls. So I took her back to my place and introduced her to my parents.

My dad asked her a bunch of questions and I just stayed quiet (I get really drained around my parents - real testosterone killers), but it went well. Afterwards, I showed her around the house and she pet my dogs a lot, but it was awkward. I took her to my room and expected to get a little sexual finally being isolated together, but after a few seconds she just quickly left - no sexual tension.

We went for a walk and throughout her talking, she commented how she found it funny that I touched her butt and body a lot. She doesn't mind my touch and bumps into me a lot. But she doesn't get me sexually excited, doesn't touch back in a sexual or enticing way, and doesn't tease me sexually - more like a friend. I don't want to hold this against her considering she's not experienced in any way. But I do hate putting all this time into her for it to feel platonic to me. Anyways, she said she wanted to get home before it got dark.

So I walked her back to her car, drained and frustrated we didn't do anything sexual at all. Also frustrated at my parents and myself for not having a better plan or more aggressive plan in place. I gave her a hug and she left. I've been feeling like crap since.

It's probably my own fault for not being more dominant and taking the lead stronger. But I think it was also that I had to introduce her to my parents and that just killed the mood for me. That's likely why I feel like crap in addition to not accomplishing my goal of being sexual (my goal today was to get her to touch my dick, maybe get head or a hand job, something simple). I'm unsure if I want to keep putting time into her, if I should give it one more date and really push for something sexual, or if I need to somehow tell her my needs aren't being met (taking into account Chase's article).

What do you guys' suggest? Thanks for the advice!

Update:

I realize re-reading my post that I was overreacting. I went out with this girl yesterday (Friday night) on the premise of getting ice cream. I drove to her grandparents place, where she lives, and met her grandparents. They didn't ask any questions and were quick to like me. She showed me around a bit then we went for ice cream.

After getting ice cream and talking, we went a played pool at our college campus. We played a few fun games, just keeping it light and fun. As my place is closer (and I didn't know if my parents were home or not), I invited her over saying I needed to check on the dogs and let them outside real quick. I learned from past dates that I need to get better at transitioning and she reasoned "yeah at least if they are home you can say we just wanted to check on the dogs".

At home, she talked with my parents a bit (they were home) and pet the dogs. But then my parents went upstairs for the night and left us alone in the downstairs living room. She took off her shoes and coat and we talked for a bit about different things. I put on a movie and long story short, we cuddled, spooned, and I kissed her within 10 minutes with no resistance. She also gave me (her first ever) hand job on our small couch. I had got some light resistance ('but we can do it next time. I feel weird with your parents upstairs") but it wasn't hard to convince her. She was also open to my touch and almost let me finger her, but she said she was on her period (which I said I didn't mind) and that she'd be embarrassed. So I didn't end up fingering her, but I will next time (among other things).

Took her back home and ended out the night.

For her, this pace feels OK and that's fine with me.

Till next time,

NBW

NBW dude!! How did this work out for ya? Am in a similar situation with a virgin. A don't mind slowing down the pace a bit to build comfort but a know a need to progress or nothing will happen. She was all excited about our planned date but cancelled it the next day. A think she's nervous thinking it'll lead to sex so she's putting up so many objections an resistance yah?

A tried to persist at first an threw the objection back, ma only other moves at this stage is force a decision from her, ignore it an go cold or keep talking in a warm way to build comfort. Any advice? Thanks dude!

Hey Fluxcapacitor,

With this girl, we got somewhat physical, but I didn't do a great job leading physically so we ended up not having sex. Then she brought up how she didn't want to have sex (though she did) and it ended with me giving the ultimatum of saying if she wanted to say we were in a relationship, we'd have to have sex or it was goodbye. She said bye. In other words, if I would've confidently lead physically, the verbal issues wouldn't have ever been a problem.

With your case, I wouldn't force a decision from her (seems needy) and I'd hold off on going cold (and risk her going into autorejection thinking you stopped liking her). How did she cancel the date? What did she say exactly (and how did you respond if you did)?

A imagine my situation will end up the same, a dunno what her objection is it's either reputation at martial arts or nervous that meeting will lead to sex. Maybe both?

She cancelled the next day with a text saying she really liked me, enjoyed last night but she can't do this, she can't do that to me. She's not looking for it now or anytime soon an that she was sorry. A polite rejection trying to stroke ma ego a guess? But cause she didn't say no or that she didn't wanna a persisted an said okay that's cool but I still want to meet up an she replied saying she doesn't think it's a good idea.

Again a persisted cause a felt she needed reassurance (when we hooked up she kept asking if a was sure an why a was with her an that she really liked me so guess esteem issues?) She insisted it wasn't a good idea so I threw the objection back saying yeah cause going out an having fun would be dreadful yah?

A guess this provoked a response cause she replied saying a didn't say that a said a can't. She did say it was a bad idea at which having fun can't be a bad idea Haha a just left it at this so it doesn't seem needy but ma only other option on replying is ignoring it an talking normally asking if she had fun away? Am guessing she's still interested or she wouldn't have been provoked by the words a put in her mouth??

The forcing the decision is from an article dealing with objections, if ya can't get them to move with ya it's game over. If a can't get her out it's game over so a figured saying a like her, think she's awesome an like talking to her. A still wanna meet up an dunno if we'll get this chance again an would hate for us to miss out would be a way to push it but yeah it might seem needy dude.

OK let me comment as I read since there's a lot.

Maybe. Who knows? Doesn't matter. Your current goal should be getting her out (in person) THEN worry about sex.

"she enjoyed last night" so did you two go out last night? Following up her rejection saying "I still want to meet up" is needy. The correct response would've been "OK I understand. No need to be sorry - you have my number if you ever want to catch up" then leave it at that and move on. Sounds like you might've made the mistake when you went out last night? I can't say for sure.

"going out an having fun would be dreadful" is kind of a passive-aggressive response. That's why she responded. It's OK to reframe, but you framed "going out" with you as "dreadful", even if it was poking fun - that probably didn't help. She was unsure (probably feeling she's lower value than you) and needed reassurance that you find her attractive, so you'd say of course you'd want to go out and have a fun time (bowling, getting coffee, relaxing and talking, something low pressure?) with her. I had a girl act that same way and you get a much better response responding like this in comparison.

To clarify, you only want to ever force a decision as a last resort. But you executed in a confusing way. If she's resisting going out, you need to "punish" that bad behavior. This would be by playing it cool and not being needy - not giving her your attention. Instead, you encouraged her behavior (and probably confused her) by saying "she's awesome" and that you "like talking to her". See the difference?

So overall, it sounds like you might've messed up somewhere if you already went out with her. If that's the case, it's best you move on. Don't expect to hear from her again (though sometimes you do). If you had 10 girls you were texting and 5 lined up for dates, would she matter so much?

Hope I could help you learn a bit from a third party perspective Figure out what you did wrong and don't do it again.

NBW

NBW dude thanks for your thoughts an advice! Ma goal was to get her out in person which is why a persisted to look unfazed by the rejection, confident that she was still interested, a wouldn't cave to a little pressure an so I'd look strong. A didn't do a good job Haha!

We got together the night before she cancelled. This is when she told me she was a virgin. A had bad logistics an didn't think a could push for sex, new city, new club, car parked miles away an taking some friends home after the party a knew a full escalation would be difficult when she brought up being a virgin it forced me to reset an set up a date.

A have run through a million times of the night an a got full compliance an investment an a later found out she told all of her friends about the date on the way home to then cancel hours later. A don't think a made a costly mistake here an think it's she perceived herself lower value an worried?

Ah fuck a totally see how throwing the objection back was passive aggressive, not cool!! That's possibly irreparable damage..

A haven't forced her for a decision on the hard push yet, that was something a was thinking of using when a see her in person at training. Calling her awesome is intended for reassurance that a do want to meet up with her but a can see how it'll encourage that behaviour an be confusing.

We haven't went out yet, that's why a was being persistent but think I've messed up big time! A have other girls am texting an a few dates lined up anyway but this one is girlfriend material to me. Not cool fucking this one up! Am guessing a shouldn't use the hard push here? Thanks dude!

Fluxcapacitor, I actually think the hard push is your only option here but totally agree with NewBee that it's a last resort. From what I've read she controls the frame and this ties your hands.

You might have made a mistake in the interaction, if you didn't or you recovered it would have been a mood change. You can't control this so it's always worth trying again, the passive aggressive text wouldn't have helped your odds here so you've got a few options left.

1) Stay warm, keep the status quo which keeps her frame, gives her control. You'll still have to try again if you want but her shields will be up to your advances.
2) Go cold, risk auto rejection, look bothered by the rejection after being passive aggressive but punishes her behaviour and might encourage her to come back.
3) Hard push, this will give validation to reassure her but lets her know that you're interested (value issue) and moves your interaction forward to an outcome.

Being warm will kill attraction and will come across that you'll wait which is needy. Being cold you're waiting for her to react which she might not if she's in auto rejection. Both of these require time to change her mood and to try again. The hard push forces action, and if she was sold on the product she'll be likely to buy with this push.

Your tone and words are incredibly important here so that it doesn't come across as needy and that you're not bothered by the outcome. This has to be smooth and confident.

SilenceintheSnow